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old timers look here must be 50+ years only

Old 07-12-2019, 05:37 AM
  #7076  
FlyerInOKC
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It seems an entire generation of Englishmen and Frenchman were loss in the great war. The US entered late and took some losses but nothing like the French and English forces.
Old 07-12-2019, 07:27 AM
  #7077  
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Theory has it that major wars have their uses for "thinning the herd". There may be some truth to that. Look after WWII at how culture changed to be more civilized, and look at today with an over populated planet. Not saying war is good, but on the flip side, it does bring people to a better state of civility.
Old 07-12-2019, 07:46 AM
  #7078  
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Originally Posted by FlyerInOKC
It seems an entire generation of Englishmen and Frenchman were loss in the great war. The US entered late and took some losses but nothing like the French and English forces.
Yes and I've noticed that few of the sons of today's political leaders are in the army.
Old 07-12-2019, 08:42 AM
  #7079  
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And we have a cowardly draft dodger for a president.
Old 07-12-2019, 09:09 AM
  #7080  
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Well Bill Clinton is irrelevant today.




Except for the Epstien stuff of course.
Old 07-12-2019, 09:36 AM
  #7081  
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Originally Posted by FlyerInOKC
And we have a cowardly draft dodger for a president.
Doesn't stop him chucking up a salute whenever he thinks the occasion demands it.
Old 07-12-2019, 09:45 AM
  #7082  
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And the Mod hammer comes down in 3, 2, 1......
Old 07-12-2019, 11:34 AM
  #7083  
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Quick lets change the subject! Anybody building anything? Here is the current state of my first of two Ken Willard Sunday Fighters. I just need to add something to plug the wing struts into. A buddy gave me a small used round aluminum cowl. I can't decide if I should use it on the Allies version or the German version.
Old 07-12-2019, 12:19 PM
  #7084  
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Snicker, nice segue! If the import of URL were working from FB I would post some pics of the Liberty Sport I'm building. Unfortunately they all come up corrupted.
Old 07-12-2019, 12:54 PM
  #7085  
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I think they call it Facebook because it is so frustrating you want to beat your face against something hard like a book!
Old 07-12-2019, 01:01 PM
  #7086  
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I do believe you are correct. Very little there worth looking at anyway because I don't care if your baby dribbled and looked cute doing it, or that your kid just did a dance. I store pictures there, but since they no longer load, and not just this forum, but others as well, I stopped doing that and plan to just delete it all.
Old 07-12-2019, 08:23 PM
  #7087  
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  1. Back to the Great War eh? The cowling should definitely go on the Allied model. The German rotary engined aircraft were not very good!
  2. I am building this American classic in between repairing Barons.
  3. Looks like the next British Prime Minister will be eleected by 70,000 members of the Conservative Party. The fact that he's also a blond buffoon has nothing to do with it!
Old 07-13-2019, 04:21 AM
  #7088  
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Hi Telemaster Sales:

Greetings from 'getting real hot' Wickenburg.Arizona..

I like the looks of your 'American classic; what is it? I am about to start on what looks to be an ambitious/possibly difficult build, the JALOPAPLANE by Eddie Ajamian; got the plans copied, already have a Captain Eddie Pilot Figure, and set of 9" spoked wheels with about 100 spokes per wheel, [been saving them for a special project]. The Jalop may be it; planning to go electric power with either big 50 series AXIs or up to 63 series Chinese made Neo motors; so wish me luck here. I just turned 75 this past Wed, and I saw a previous 'net' build thread re the Jalop.....took the builder 9 1/2 yrs to build....Yikes! Anyways.......

Also, I like the looks of those Coupes', where can I get a set of plans?

Will close for now, and I sure do enjoy the Old Timers' thread, I feel welcome here, best regards to everyone from Wickenburg, AZ,

Joe Nagy. [an OT for sure, 68 yrs happily destroying Balsa, and 50 yrs in RC]
Old 07-13-2019, 07:36 AM
  #7089  
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If I weren't backed up on projects as much as I am, I always wanted to build a Procter Jenny. That looks like a great challenge and done right looks like the real thing. However, between the Laser project, the B-25, P-51, Corsair, SIG Liberty Sport, as well as a few more that are just rolls of paper(hence the laser project) I don't think I would be able to get to it any time soon.

Then again if I win the lotto and can retire, Hire someone to do the house repairs, sell it, find a place with a nice be workshop and spend the rest of my time building and flying.

One can dream, right?
Old 07-13-2019, 09:16 PM
  #7090  
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Morning Joe,

My "American Classic" is a Big Guff. The model was designed by Dr Walt Good and it won the American Radio Controlled National Championships in 1938-1940. His twin brother, Bill Good, designed the radio.

As for the "Coupes," please let me clear up a mis-understanding. If you were referring to the models pictured below, they are called Barons. The Baron was designed by Christian Chauzit in the late Sixties or early Seventies and is as much a classic trainer in France as the Sig Kadett is in America or the Super 60 in Great Britain. Une Coupe in French means a cup so La Coupe Des Barons means "The Barons' Cup," a light-hearted competition held every year in the south-east of France. There is a plan for the Baron on the Outerzone but the model has been cleaned up and ailerons added. Another source of plans may be AeroFred but I have never used their service. Ailerons are banned in the competition, the original model was three channel and powered by a 15-19 motor but you can use anything up to a 35 two-stroke or a 52 four-stroke in La Coupe. https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=2086

The Big Guff plan is also available on The Outerzone https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=7456 but I bought a short kit from Laser Design Services.
Old 07-14-2019, 10:30 AM
  #7091  
Joe Nagy
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Hi once again Telemaster Sales;

Many thanx for your quick reply; The GUFF by the Good Bros., I did not recognizeher in bare bones, I have been reading about the Good Bros & their Guff most of my life in the modelling press. & double thanx for the Coupe info, my query was re the French La Coupe Des Barons version. Those over-aged French/Brit Kids' just appear to be having too much fun, and that is what our great and wonderful hobby is all about, and for. & I will check out your Des Baron's plans sources, and hopefully add one to my stable; although I will be converting it to electric power; as about 6 years ago I lost my hearing totally, and now have R&LS Cochlear Implants, and can hear better than Superman hisself, and simply cannot stand the sounds of glow/gas engines, the sound is actually painful, so now it is quiet electrics for me; the price one pays for getting older I guess.

Re your GUFF: How are you planning to finish it up; like modern current engines, covering, control[s], radio etc., or original antique type equipment; or a mixture of both. It looks like a great and interesting project. Please keep us informed, word'n'photos, on your GUFF, and especially on how she flys.

Will close for now, many thanx to you again, and you Older Kids' across the big Pond, continue having 'Too Much Fun', best regards from Wickenburg, Arizona, USA,

Joe Nagy.
Old 07-14-2019, 10:11 PM
  #7092  
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Morning Again Joe

I'm too impatient to use traditional finishes! I am going to use Solartex as the covering. Dark green/olive drab for the fuselage and Antique for the wings and tailplane. Many Americans find it strange that I am not going to finish it in orange overall as the Good brothers did but I have extensive stocks of Solartex in these colours, I have no plans to use the Olive Drab on anything else, and I was aways brought up to be careful with money! Besides the only Big Guff which flew in Europe for many years was the late Peter Russell's model which was finished in black and yellow heavyweight tissue. Mr Russell used to write articles regularly in the aeromodelling press.



I will be using a Laser four-stroke glow engine in the Big Guff, either a 70 or an 80. The 80 might over-power it but it is nearly 4 ozs (110 grammes) heavier than the 70 which might help get the c/g right.

La Coupe Des Barons takes place in September this year. We will be taking down a team of seven pilots this time. Last year I was the sole representative of the club and the only Englishman to participate in the event. There was a German contestant who is married to a French woman who owns property nearby and a pilot from Switzerland too. Neither of these countries are far away from Ste Marie d'Alloix where the competition is held. I have built two Barons in case I damage one of them just before the event. Needless to say, your humble servant, a qualified instructor in two countries, has contrived to damage both of them at the same time! I do not usually give my models names but I finished the first one in WW1 Russian colours and the second one in inter-war RAF colours, consequently they are Boris and Bertie respectively! I ran an electric motor last year but will run an OS four-stroke this year. Anybody got a spare cylinder-head for an OS 52 Surpass?




Being a bit of a linguist it occured to me yesterday that the French word "coupe" means a cup but it also means a cut, and if something is "coupé" it means it's been cut. In automotive terms then, I suppose that a "Coupé" is a car which has had its roof and/or chassis cut or shortened!

Must close as a seamstress is coming round later to shorten my curtains. I have to tidy the house a bit!

Last edited by Telemaster Sales UK; 07-14-2019 at 10:20 PM.
Old 07-17-2019, 01:38 AM
  #7093  
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In spite of what I have written in the post above, I am considering using a traditional silk and dope or silk and water-based polyurathane finish on the Big Guff, but then what do I do with a few yards of Olive Drab Solartex?

The Chairman of my club when I lived in England used ladies' polyester dress lining material when covering his vintage model.




PS. Joe.

The Guff and the Big Guff were different animals!

The Guff was a free flight, proof-of-concept model, with a six-foot polyhedral wing. The Big Guff had an eight-foot wingspan and was designed for radio control from the outset.
https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=2319
https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=7456

Last edited by Telemaster Sales UK; 07-17-2019 at 01:56 AM.
Old 07-17-2019, 04:33 AM
  #7094  
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Nice looking airplane no wonder he is smiling!
Old 07-17-2019, 01:12 PM
  #7095  
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Hi once more Telemaster Sales;

I must agree with Flyer in OKC that a'smilin' Older Kid with the beautiful yellow RC'd FF ship sure looks nice. It looks like a Carl Goldberg SAILPLANE; earlier this year I eBayed a very nice short kit of same, and have left it out where I can get at it as a future build. Seeing his model really whets my building urge for sure.

But then, I just picked up my pdf'd plans from the copy place yesterday for 'La Coupe des Barons' through OuterZone UK Free Plans, and I do want to build one of these real soon also, as all those smiling faces photo'd at the 'l8 Saint Marie d'Alliox meet, got me wanting to smile also. Many Thanx to TS for the Outerzone lead.

Also, I did not know that there were 2 Guffs', I only new of the RC version; & TS, however you finish your Guff should be AOK, just be sure to send photos of same for all of us to drool over herein RCU.

Will Close, and go back and roll over my 'Barons' plans, keep a'smilin', best regards from Wickenburg, Arizona,

Joe Nagy.
Old 07-17-2019, 09:20 PM
  #7096  
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Quite right Joe, it is a Carl Goldberg Sailplane. I had it listed as a Cumulus but it's obviously not a Cumulus. I have corrected the listing.

I had a good session at the flying field yesterday. My English trainee is making good progress and I flew Bertie, the RAF Baron, for the first time since the crash. He flew very well with an OS 48 FS Surpass replacing the OS 52 FS which was damaged in the crash. I have managed to source a used cylinder head and rocker box for the 52 but the bloke wants 70€ for it. Thats £63 or $79 US. As these engines are no longer made, and because spares are hard to find, prices have gone up. Guess I'll just wait until my pension is paid then bite the bullet. Mind you, my afternoon was spoiled a little when the throttle trim on my Spektrum DX9 decided it wanted to play fun and games. It allowed me to reduce the trim but when I tried to push it forwards it would stick. Two of my clubmates, both electronic engineers are coming round this morning to look at it. They claim that it might be dirt or oil getting into the works caused by my love of glow motors. I'm getting a bit disillusioned with Spektrum. The DX9 is quite an expensive transmitter but it's caused me more problems than any of the other transmitters I've ever had.

That picture of the Sailplane was taken in 2012 at a Vintage meeting which I organised within my club. It was quite windy but we all flew. I've attached a few more pictures of the event below. Some of the men seen sitting down, miraculously without cups of tea, have died within the last seven years, but Derek James, seen here with his Aeronca Sedan and his 1977 Ford Escort Estate car, is still with us albeit minus some of his liver. Derek is a Rolls-Royce trained engineer.

Seize the time gentlemen, seize the time.







Last edited by Telemaster Sales UK; 07-17-2019 at 09:40 PM.
Old 07-18-2019, 03:16 PM
  #7097  
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Joe, have you always lived in AZ ?? For some reason your name is sure familiar . I used to do a lot of traveling, and once owned some property in Wickenburg . Red
Old 07-18-2019, 04:21 PM
  #7098  
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Hi red;

No, we have not always lived in Arizona; moved down from cold Canada about 39 yrs ago, lived in the greater Phoenix area until about 4 yrs ago, then moved out to the small, western frontier, gold-mining town of Wickenburg. Beautiful small frontier town, we love it here, only 3 stoplites, and very little traffic compared to Phnx. During the winter months, horses , [of da ropin' variety], almost outnumber human folks, as the town is very active in the Roping Rodeo world. For RC flying, we fly off and old, former 'WWII Troop Carrying Glider Training Base' west of Wick, on Hwy 60.

We've attended a good many RC events in FL, CA and AZ over da years.

Also. we owned a home in Englewood , FL, but the hurricane scares/worries, every summer/fall season, caused us to sell it and stay safe, in good ole'hot'n'dry Arizona.

Dat's us'ns in a nutshell, best regards from Wickenburg, AZ,

Joe Nagy.
Old 07-19-2019, 04:56 PM
  #7099  
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OH WELL, must be my age JOE. but the name sure rings a loud bell . ENJOY RED
Old 07-25-2019, 07:23 AM
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I have now reached the stage where the fuselage on the Big Guff is symmetrical, the position of the servos has been finalised and the forward 1/16" sheeting has been glued in place, grain vertical as per Dr Good's instructions on the plan. I will use a closed loop to actuate the rudder and either a snake or a balsa pushrod for the elevator. The next stage is make up the nose blocks and to cover the entire fuselage including the 1/16" sheeting with 1/32" sheet balsa, grain running along the length of the fuselage sides but I'm afraid I will have to disobey the plan instructions and use the sheeting across the fuselage on the underside. I have always done this with all of my models and it makes the structure much stronger. The top of the fuselage is already covered in this way with the 1/32" balsa, a size which I have not used in nearly sixty years.

I am using a new type of aliphatic glue which I bought in England when I was last there in April. It's quite yellow and unlike other aliphatics, does not dry out clear. It was extremely thick and difficult to squeeze out of the bottle so I thinned it with water. As a glue it works well but it has been very difficult to remove the excess from the interior of the model even though you can get your hand right into the fuselage quite easily! As a result, the interior, which will be visible through the clear acetate sheet of the door when that is built, will look rather unsightly. I will use a more familiar type of glue for the rest of the build.

Once the fuselage is fully sheeted I plan to cover it before preparing my Barons for a competition in September, then I will get on with the tailplane. As regards covering I am tempted to use coloured tissue though Solartex will be much easier to apply. Maths was never my strongest subject but I worked out that the Big Guff's fuselage has a total area of 8.5 sq ft or 0.79 sq mtrs. Solartex weighs 85 grammes per sq metre which is about three ounces per square metre. Therefore the weight of Solartex covering will be less than three ounces.

Tissue and dope will be lighter but saving weight on a model of this size and type is not the priority which it could be on a smaller machine. I've seen some tissue and here: https://www.miniplanes.fr/reno-red-l...bs-description and it's certainly cheap enough. Trouble is that I haven't used tissue over sheet for sixty years so I've forgotten the technique. Do you use sanding sealer first, then a couple of coats of dope, then brush the tissue onto the surface using thinned dope or is it thinner? Do you dampen the tissue first? Which sort of dope do I use, nitrate or butyl? Shrinking or non-shrinking? Whisper it, but if I do decide to use tissue on the fuselage, I may use tissue over doculam on the fin and rudder. There is a considerable amount of sheeting on the fin anyway. The advice of the cognoscenti will as always be warmly received.

I was lucky with the servo mounts. I have been doing a fair bit of instructing since I retired to France and my favourite ARTF trainer is the Seagull Boomerang. I crashed one when I lost signal and the servo plate was sprung from the wreckage. The local cognoscenti claimed that it had crashed because I was using a cheap receiver! I bought another Boomerang and installed the old servo plate in the new model. Consequently I had a new piece of light ply cut out for standard servos. A couple of cuts with a Stanley knife, my usual balsa and ply sandwhich for the screws to grip on, and they were installed in the Big Guff.

As you can see in the pictures the servos are mounted close to the F2 former. I will use a small servo between the F1 and F2 former to actuate the throttle and the rx battery will fit in the same space. Please note that neither the tank, servos, the engine nor the receiver are fitted into place, they are just placed into position for the photograph and that the servos shown are old servos. I will treat the Big Guff to a new pair when final installation occurs. There will have to be a certain amount of making good around the F2 former where the tank goes through. The tank is another find from the Boomerang but then I may use a shorter fatter tank.

Walt Good's model featured a switch high up on the forward fuselage side. I was thinking of replicating the arrangement with this switch which I've owned for years but felt that the receiver could be switched on accidentally when loading the model into the van. I may however mount the switch, or a switch, on the inside of the model so that you have to open the door to switch it on!

So onwards and upwards. A little more sanding, a little filler perhaps, the nose blocks then the 1/32" sheeting!

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